2014 Corolla - Orange Peel
- Thread starter newcorollaowner
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This doesn't sound right. Any respectable body shop will warranty their paint job longer than two years. Good refinish paint should last.
As I said earlier, I had my Honda repainted because of defective paint. It was Honda that paid, but the job was done across the street at the Toyota dealership. The same owner owns both. The Honda dealer didn't have an auto body shop. My receipt says the work is warranted for life.
As I said earlier, I had my Honda repainted because of defective paint. It was Honda that paid, but the job was done across the street at the Toyota dealership. The same owner owns both. The Honda dealer didn't have an auto body shop. My receipt says the work is warranted for life.
I know that's just another lie and excuse not to do anything. I always keep my car clean, waxed and maintained anyways I will never deal with the dealership for anything ever again I'm about to the point of just doing my own oil and filter change myself and not let them touch my car and make money doing the service from Toyota.
I wouldn't go that far, if you're getting free oil changes. But I do usually check the work of any shop afterward. I had a bad experience with a Datsun dealer way back in 1976 with a new truck. They were supposed to drain and refill by rear-end lub as part of it's maintenance. I drove around for several days before I realized my differential was empty. I noticed it seemed noisy so I checked. I've never trusted dealers so completely since.
The matter is in the hands of The Regional Toyota Rep at this point and the Customer has been contacted by their office.
which is a lie again I haven't talked to anyone from Toyota since before I filed a complaint with BBB and i didn't talk to a regional rep just a case manager and she said they go by what the dealership says!
which is a lie again I haven't talked to anyone from Toyota since before I filed a complaint with BBB and i didn't talk to a regional rep just a case manager and she said they go by what the dealership says!
The factory panels can be dipped, the paint can be baked on.
I have no doubt that the original factory paint is (in most cases, maybe not NCO's car) better than that from a body shop.
But a body shop paint should last more than two years. They give you a lifetime warranty, but it won't last that long - my factory paint is delaminating, but my car is 12-years old. (The body shop just figures they will eat the loss and re-paint it for you if you keep the car that long.)
I have no doubt that the original factory paint is (in most cases, maybe not NCO's car) better than that from a body shop.
But a body shop paint should last more than two years. They give you a lifetime warranty, but it won't last that long - my factory paint is delaminating, but my car is 12-years old. (The body shop just figures they will eat the loss and re-paint it for you if you keep the car that long.)
I've tried numerous times the number is always busy so I went back to check the status of the case and that's what I found out they say it's already resolved. I emailed them letting them know they lied to me about it but found they already closed the case after I told them about lying to me there not there help consumers anymore than anyone else I contacted a lawyer and here's what they said.
There is one option that you can take on your own by pursuing the matter through informal arbitration. Several auto manufacturers provide this, including Toyota.
There is no cost for the program and it does not require an attorney.
Toyota's program is administered by NCDS (National Center for Dispute Settlement).
These should be helpful web links to get you started. They are also more than willing to answer your questions by phone.
General information:
http://www.ncdsusa.org/index.php?id=14
Application Form:
http://www.ncdsusa.org/documents/Toyota Customer Claim Form.pdf
The process typically takes around 40-60 days from start to finish. If the outcome is not in your favor, please feel free to contact me at that time so that we can review your legal options at that time.
There is one option that you can take on your own by pursuing the matter through informal arbitration. Several auto manufacturers provide this, including Toyota.
There is no cost for the program and it does not require an attorney.
Toyota's program is administered by NCDS (National Center for Dispute Settlement).
These should be helpful web links to get you started. They are also more than willing to answer your questions by phone.
General information:
http://www.ncdsusa.org/index.php?id=14
Application Form:
http://www.ncdsusa.org/documents/Toyota Customer Claim Form.pdf
The process typically takes around 40-60 days from start to finish. If the outcome is not in your favor, please feel free to contact me at that time so that we can review your legal options at that time.
BBB "resolved"
Thats why I said that you wouldn't go far with the BBB.
They are not a consumer protection organization, they merely act as an intermediate so that consumer and business can talk in a civilized way.
"Resolved", in their vocabulary, does not mean that you got satisfaction, it means that their job is done : you had a chance to express yourself and you did receive an answer, whatever unsatisfactory.
They really don't care about what is in the answer, they won't feel "lied to", because their mandate is just to get you an answer. Any answer.
Since the dealer answered (whatever, really !), their rating remain intact. :blink:
But... you now have another, kind of "official", piece of lie for your file. Keep it, date, what was writen, etc. Good luck !
Thats why I said that you wouldn't go far with the BBB.
They are not a consumer protection organization, they merely act as an intermediate so that consumer and business can talk in a civilized way.
"Resolved", in their vocabulary, does not mean that you got satisfaction, it means that their job is done : you had a chance to express yourself and you did receive an answer, whatever unsatisfactory.
They really don't care about what is in the answer, they won't feel "lied to", because their mandate is just to get you an answer. Any answer.
Since the dealer answered (whatever, really !), their rating remain intact. :blink:
But... you now have another, kind of "official", piece of lie for your file. Keep it, date, what was writen, etc. Good luck !
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Yea I know I'm finding out now the dealership isn't screwing people over left and right lying about people's income and there car's having rust damage on new vehicle's I've heard from several people who's said they're heard a lot of bad things about them never heard one person say anything good about them I wish I would've done more research before going there.
It always pays to do your homework. I had a bad experience with the service department at my local Toyota dealer about 10 years ago. So the last two Toyota's I've bought (an '04 Tacoma and my Corolla) were both bought at Toyota dealers which were not that one. In fact the one where I bought the Tacoma gave me a decent deal but the buying experience was so pleasant it'll probably be the place where I buy my next Toyota, despite the fact that it's 30-45 mins from where I live.
By contrast the dealer where I bought my Corolla was your typical game-playing, fast-talking dealership. I enjoy the back and forth game so I was amused, the best was when they told me the Corolla I wanted was a rare model. I literally laughed out loud. The games stopped when they realized mine would be a cash sale. I got them down to a fair price and the sales guy even delivered the car to my house
Bottom line, Yelp is your friend when it comes to car buying (and just about everything else). Either that or take someone with you who knows the game and is good at it.
Kevin
By contrast the dealer where I bought my Corolla was your typical game-playing, fast-talking dealership. I enjoy the back and forth game so I was amused, the best was when they told me the Corolla I wanted was a rare model. I literally laughed out loud. The games stopped when they realized mine would be a cash sale. I got them down to a fair price and the sales guy even delivered the car to my house
Bottom line, Yelp is your friend when it comes to car buying (and just about everything else). Either that or take someone with you who knows the game and is good at it.
Kevin
When I bought my Eco Base, the sale "consultant" was desperately pushing another unit equiped with all gizmos, telling me how I would miss this and that if I went for a base model.
When he told me he couldn't get a base model for weeks (but i could see one on the lot...) I simply said "OK, we stop everything here". He was still calling me back when I got out.
I simply went to a family owned dealer farther away and the experience was night and day and the prices were lower to begin with, even before negociation.
Some dealers really act as if the next dealer is 500 miles away !
Again, know what you want and don't be in a hurry or impulsive when buying a car !
When he told me he couldn't get a base model for weeks (but i could see one on the lot...) I simply said "OK, we stop everything here". He was still calling me back when I got out.
I simply went to a family owned dealer farther away and the experience was night and day and the prices were lower to begin with, even before negociation.
Some dealers really act as if the next dealer is 500 miles away !
Again, know what you want and don't be in a hurry or impulsive when buying a car !
It always pays to do your homework. I had a bad experience with the service department at my local Toyota dealer about 10 years ago. So the last two Toyota's I've bought (an '04 Tacoma and my Corolla) were both bought at Toyota dealers which were not that one. In fact the one where I bought the Tacoma gave me a decent deal but the buying experience was so pleasant it'll probably be the place where I buy my next Toyota, despite the fact that it's 30-45 mins from where I live.
By contrast the dealer where I bought my Corolla was your typical game-playing, fast-talking dealership. I enjoy the back and forth game so I was amused, the best was when they told me the Corolla I wanted was a rare model. I literally laughed out loud. The games stopped when they realized mine would be a cash sale. I got them down to a fair price and the sales guy even delivered the car to my house
Bottom line, Yelp is your friend when it comes to car buying (and just about everything else). Either that or take someone with you who knows the game and is good at it.
Kevin
By contrast the dealer where I bought my Corolla was your typical game-playing, fast-talking dealership. I enjoy the back and forth game so I was amused, the best was when they told me the Corolla I wanted was a rare model. I literally laughed out loud. The games stopped when they realized mine would be a cash sale. I got them down to a fair price and the sales guy even delivered the car to my house
Bottom line, Yelp is your friend when it comes to car buying (and just about everything else). Either that or take someone with you who knows the game and is good at it.
Kevin
Well, you might win or lose, just as in court and its a much simpler and less stressful procedure (not to mention more economical).
Plus Toyota would officially know your case (I have a feeling that your dealer didn't present your hole story to Toyota...).
Remember to be focused and prepared (especially your communications with the dealer including this last BBB response).
Plus Toyota would officially know your case (I have a feeling that your dealer didn't present your hole story to Toyota...).
Remember to be focused and prepared (especially your communications with the dealer including this last BBB response).
It's almost like court, only less formal and no lawyer.
You'd have to submit a file in advance (contract, registration, date and proof of your visits to the dealer and his responses - plus the BBB one - and any other communications with Toyota representatives) that will all be forwarded to Toyota to prepare themselves.
An independant evaluation of your paint might help, thouh the arbitrator will probably ask you to bring the car at the audition so he/she could inspect it.
At the audition, arbitrator will listen to you and Toyota representative and ask questions to help him/her make a decision, which will come later.
At any point, Toyota might present you an offer. You can still negotiate !
Depending on your local laws, you might still be able to go to appeal in court if you are not satisfied with the arbitrator decision. But if you accept it, it becomes final.
As I said, as in Court, you might lose or win. Life is not a movie and the good don't always win !
You'd have to submit a file in advance (contract, registration, date and proof of your visits to the dealer and his responses - plus the BBB one - and any other communications with Toyota representatives) that will all be forwarded to Toyota to prepare themselves.
An independant evaluation of your paint might help, thouh the arbitrator will probably ask you to bring the car at the audition so he/she could inspect it.
At the audition, arbitrator will listen to you and Toyota representative and ask questions to help him/her make a decision, which will come later.
At any point, Toyota might present you an offer. You can still negotiate !
Depending on your local laws, you might still be able to go to appeal in court if you are not satisfied with the arbitrator decision. But if you accept it, it becomes final.
As I said, as in Court, you might lose or win. Life is not a movie and the good don't always win !
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newcorollaowner - Any updates on the aribitration proceedings?
No the dealership is supposed to call me first of next week to see what they can do to make me happy whether it be another car or whatever. They were REALLY nice this time actually wanting to try and make me happy. Filing a complaint with attorney general helped a lot I think he mentioned he has to answer to the attorney general regarding my car and issue I'm having.
You're almost two months into this now. Each day and mile, the car loses value and I think your chances of a favorable (by your definition) go down and down. Plus it gives Toyota more time to claim environmental factors, although I think that is bogus.
I have mixed feelings on the merit of your case. My corolla doesn't have that look, but I certainly have seen new cars that do. You got unlucky, but you're not the only one and you did accept delivery in that condition. If the condition is not outside the realm of normal variation, they don't have to help you, and honestly I don't think it is.
Mixed in with this, I think you have a pretty serious case of buyers remorse over not getting the car you really wanedt. Hate to be discouraging, but I don't think you have more than maybe a 5% chance of getting what you want, if that.
You're clearly upset about the vehicle and also express dislikes for other things about it that you knew when you bought the car. If you are that unhappy, maybe its best to cut your losses and move on. Life is too short to be so upset at a car. Can you go to a Carmax or such that purchases vehicles outright? Get a quote - I don't think you're going to get hit much for the orange peel, if at all. Its just becoming a common problem. Once you get that quote, figure out what car you can afford with your tough credit situation and go from there. You might have to get something other than a Corolla. But you would be rid of a car that is causing you a lot of distress and end up in a car you might be much happier with.
This has dragged on way too long, the dealer and Toyota aren't too interested in helping you, the BBB was as useless as usual. The AG could turn out to be of some help, but the best you're likely to get is not the full buy-back you want, but a dollar award of a few hundred dollars, if that, in my opinion. Is that gonna really make you happier. And you might not even get that. My advice, time to move on. I've done it, it sucks, you lose some money, but you end up happier and in a little while the experience blows over.
I have mixed feelings on the merit of your case. My corolla doesn't have that look, but I certainly have seen new cars that do. You got unlucky, but you're not the only one and you did accept delivery in that condition. If the condition is not outside the realm of normal variation, they don't have to help you, and honestly I don't think it is.
Mixed in with this, I think you have a pretty serious case of buyers remorse over not getting the car you really wanedt. Hate to be discouraging, but I don't think you have more than maybe a 5% chance of getting what you want, if that.
You're clearly upset about the vehicle and also express dislikes for other things about it that you knew when you bought the car. If you are that unhappy, maybe its best to cut your losses and move on. Life is too short to be so upset at a car. Can you go to a Carmax or such that purchases vehicles outright? Get a quote - I don't think you're going to get hit much for the orange peel, if at all. Its just becoming a common problem. Once you get that quote, figure out what car you can afford with your tough credit situation and go from there. You might have to get something other than a Corolla. But you would be rid of a car that is causing you a lot of distress and end up in a car you might be much happier with.
This has dragged on way too long, the dealer and Toyota aren't too interested in helping you, the BBB was as useless as usual. The AG could turn out to be of some help, but the best you're likely to get is not the full buy-back you want, but a dollar award of a few hundred dollars, if that, in my opinion. Is that gonna really make you happier. And you might not even get that. My advice, time to move on. I've done it, it sucks, you lose some money, but you end up happier and in a little while the experience blows over.
Yea I'm not trying anymore I realize the dealership or Toyota aren't going to do anything. Look at GM with the faulty ignition switches killing people and everything and still don't want to admit to anything and or fix anything. So you know Toyota sure isn't going to fix any paint issues. It's just frustrating I traded in a car that had no orange peel at all and paint looked great to get a new Toyota just to find out later that it has orange peel feels like I downgraded instead of upgraded. Like I said earlier in the post if I knew I had to look over a brand new car with a fine tooth comb like I would with a used vehicle I wouldn't have ever bought the Corolla and if the paint on my corolla is Toyota it's my first and only Toyota. I have always been a big Ford fan I'm definitely not a Toyota fan and never will be if this is Toyota quality. If I ever buy a new car it won't be a Toyota and I'll look at every inch of it before buying it even if I seen it come straight off the truck.
Way to go. As consumers, we don't have much power except that one: voting with our money.:thumbdown:
I guess that's the lesson learned here : inspect, inspect, inspect ! :yes:
Not of any consolation to you, but take a close look at this shinny brand new Cadillac ATS... (http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2015-cadillac-ats-coupe-first-drive/#photo-2819025/)
I guess that's the lesson learned here : inspect, inspect, inspect ! :yes:
Not of any consolation to you, but take a close look at this shinny brand new Cadillac ATS... (http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2015-cadillac-ats-coupe-first-drive/#photo-2819025/)
I know its not much consolation, but you can look at a forum for every car and see complaints of paint issues. Paint isn't as good as it used to be. On the plus side it's just cosmetic and won't actually damage anything. My car has a little orange peel, but it doesn't bother me. The first door ding or chip will, or a rattle would drive me crazy. You could try a good detailer, don't know if claying or polishing would help or not.
That Cadillac is BAD. But most people wouldn't even notice and just think how pretty the car is. That trunk has more orange peel than an actual orange. That shouldn't make it out of the factory, especially for a premium brand.
Before I bought the corolla I tested a Mazda 3 that had rust spots on the inside of the trunk lid where the paint had chipped off. Imagine that car in a few years. Salesman was really upset and said that was the first car they had received from Mazda's new plant in Mexico. Toyota is going to build a plant in Mexico too. More American jobs being lost. My corolla wax USA built but not sure what plant.
Before I bought the corolla I tested a Mazda 3 that had rust spots on the inside of the trunk lid where the paint had chipped off. Imagine that car in a few years. Salesman was really upset and said that was the first car they had received from Mazda's new plant in Mexico. Toyota is going to build a plant in Mexico too. More American jobs being lost. My corolla wax USA built but not sure what plant.
My car I traded in on the corolla was 2010 black fusion with nice clear orange peel free paint thought I was getting a better car only to find out the paint is covered in orange peel if I knew that I would've kept the fusion instead. Only good thing about the car is the gas mileage and that's the only good thing about it. My first and only Toyota ever and only car I buy from the dealership I bought it from as well I'd rather pay more money somewhere else than deal with them. I know most new vehicles come with orange peel from the factory but doesn't mean it's supposed to be like that. Sad thing is the average consumer doesn't know what it is to even look for and notice it. The director I talked to at the dealership said there's a lot of customers complaining about the same issue with the paint. But no manufacturer will do anything about it if they don't have to like I said earlier if GM won't fix a faulty ignition switch they knew about that killed people you know no manufacturer will fix a paint issue that's not life threatening sad the world we live in only worries about money and getting more of it than customers and making and keeping them happy.
Way to go. As consumers, we don't have much power except that one: voting with our money.:thumbdown:
I guess that's the lesson learned here : inspect, inspect, inspect ! :yes:
Not of any consolation to you, but take a close look at this shinny brand new Cadillac ATS... (http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2015-cadillac-ats-coupe-first-drive/#photo-2819025/)
I guess that's the lesson learned here : inspect, inspect, inspect ! :yes:
Not of any consolation to you, but take a close look at this shinny brand new Cadillac ATS... (http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2015-cadillac-ats-coupe-first-drive/#photo-2819025/)
Indeed, it is sad not to have notice it on delivery inspection and it might or might not affect future resale value but surely the car has other qualities (value, comfort, economy, equipment) that motivated the choice in the first place and still remain.
Tupelo for the car, Buffalo for the engine?
Funny how Mazda, Toyota and Mexico mentioned together have me thinking about our now "global economy." Despite all the marketing talk about engagement in communities, our world is really big corporations centered. They will go wherever wages are lower and obigations less strenuous. Camry assembled by Subaru, next Yaris being a Mazda2, Kia, BMW, Daimler in Mexico...
Canada is most likely to be more affected (though the new tendancy toward a lower canadian vs US dollar might help compensate for more binding working laws, but will hurt consumers with higher prices) despite our plans having top notch productivity after billions in investments from national and local governments... (i.e. us, taxpayers). GM Oshawa is probably next il line and Toyota Cambridge might also be in jeopardy. Camaro used to be bult near here also (GM Boisbriand), now replaced by yet another shopping center... Well, we "stole" Burger King from the US!
Tupelo for the car, Buffalo for the engine?
Funny how Mazda, Toyota and Mexico mentioned together have me thinking about our now "global economy." Despite all the marketing talk about engagement in communities, our world is really big corporations centered. They will go wherever wages are lower and obigations less strenuous. Camry assembled by Subaru, next Yaris being a Mazda2, Kia, BMW, Daimler in Mexico...
Canada is most likely to be more affected (though the new tendancy toward a lower canadian vs US dollar might help compensate for more binding working laws, but will hurt consumers with higher prices) despite our plans having top notch productivity after billions in investments from national and local governments... (i.e. us, taxpayers). GM Oshawa is probably next il line and Toyota Cambridge might also be in jeopardy. Camaro used to be bult near here also (GM Boisbriand), now replaced by yet another shopping center... Well, we "stole" Burger King from the US!
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How does quitting get us anywhere in life? I'm absolutely shocked.:blink:
As a consumer you have legal rights and they have been violated. In my opinion, you have been defrauded and laying down and dying is exactly what they are hoping you will do. You have lost thousands of dollars in value on your car.
GM certainly is doing something about the ignition switch problem in the form of a massive recall. Don't give up! Quitters never win and winners never quit!
You said you were taking the advice of an attorney, (and not someone encouraging you to quit), and pursuing the matter via arbitration. What happened?
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You're right, it was built in Tupelo, I remember th dealer telling me that.
The Mazda I drove was 70% Mexican content, that really surprised me. Until just recently the 3 was 100% made in Japan.
After all the great press about the 3, I was underwhelme, other than the new design's great looks. Car felt slow even with Skyactiv engine and stick shift, rode stiff, and steering felt numb, and the interior seemed cheap, no backup camera.. All the opposite of all the reviews, and typically what the reviews say of the Corolla.
The Mazda I drove was 70% Mexican content, that really surprised me. Until just recently the 3 was 100% made in Japan.
After all the great press about the 3, I was underwhelme, other than the new design's great looks. Car felt slow even with Skyactiv engine and stick shift, rode stiff, and steering felt numb, and the interior seemed cheap, no backup camera.. All the opposite of all the reviews, and typically what the reviews say of the Corolla.
Well I talked to a case manager with Toyota and they took the dealerships side if I go through arbitration there just going to say and do the same thing say that the paint is supposed to be that way since other vehicles have similar paint so it's normal. I can spend 2-3 months waiting for the arbitration process only to hear them say what they already said its normal since other vehicles have similar paint. Then get a lawyer involved which is no guarantee either. And like the other user said the longer it goes on the less likely hood of a satisfiable result. I talked to the same director and the dealership week before last on Thursday and he was supposed to call me first of last week never heard from him either. But he said there's a lot of customers complaining about the same paint issue I'm complaining about and he'll talk to the GM and get back with me but here it is about to be the first of the next week and still haven't heard from them.
I doubt his car will have less future value because of the orange peel. And sometimes just accepting something and moving on is the healthiest thing to do, especially when you likely aren't going to get anywhere. Not to be unkind to the owner, but accepting delivery of the car with the paint in that condition would weigh heavily in Toyota's favor in arbitration. This wasn't a hidden detect so I don't see how the buyer was defrauded or had his rights violated.
Not to be unkind to you either but I NEVER thought I had to look at a brand new car over with a fine tooth comb! If I HAD KNOWN it looked like that I WOULD'VE NEVER bought it. No vehicle should have orange peel mine is just as bad if not worse than the photo of the Caddy you posted I know now to look at a any car wether it be new or used but do now.
Well, maybe not thousands.
It is a cosmetic defect (apparently more spread then we think) and not so obvious since it wasn't even notice at time of buying.
A lot of factors influence resale value.
For instance, even GM recalled cars haven't pummeled in resale value.
Of course the difference here is that it was a volountarily hidden threatening engineering defect.
But still, what amount of energy and money those families had to spent to get a result.
"Quitters never win" has an obvious ring of truth to it, but so does "Choose your battles".
Life is short and you have to weight in what you could get vs what you would spend in energy and money.
Especially in a case where you start with two strikes (accepting delivery and giving hints of buyer remorse).
I know I sound rude, but you would be facing those arguments in a procedure.
That's how it works: will the cost of procedures exceed the benefit ?
(Benifit being here maybe, only maybe, a new unit at a fee for depreciation of the first one, or a random amount based on hypothetical lost in resale value for a car otherwise working as intended).
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it is a good thing, but they even do this benifice calculation in criminal justice (plea bargaining)...
...so that's an honest lawyer would say.
Unless one has the time, money and energy to fight for the principle of it.
Because you do have something to lose on those three aspects, even if you are in your own right and win.
We are talking paint job here, not life and death. So who are we to judge that one should go ahead despite what is involved
(A dishonest lawyer would say sure, we'll do it - after checking the credit score of the customer... - without mentioning what is involved in time, money and energy).
I'm with you with arbitration, though: less of a burden, less to lose so why not? No more guarantee of winning, though.
It is a cosmetic defect (apparently more spread then we think) and not so obvious since it wasn't even notice at time of buying.
A lot of factors influence resale value.
For instance, even GM recalled cars haven't pummeled in resale value.
Of course the difference here is that it was a volountarily hidden threatening engineering defect.
But still, what amount of energy and money those families had to spent to get a result.
"Quitters never win" has an obvious ring of truth to it, but so does "Choose your battles".
Life is short and you have to weight in what you could get vs what you would spend in energy and money.
Especially in a case where you start with two strikes (accepting delivery and giving hints of buyer remorse).
I know I sound rude, but you would be facing those arguments in a procedure.
That's how it works: will the cost of procedures exceed the benefit ?
(Benifit being here maybe, only maybe, a new unit at a fee for depreciation of the first one, or a random amount based on hypothetical lost in resale value for a car otherwise working as intended).
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it is a good thing, but they even do this benifice calculation in criminal justice (plea bargaining)...
...so that's an honest lawyer would say.
Unless one has the time, money and energy to fight for the principle of it.
Because you do have something to lose on those three aspects, even if you are in your own right and win.
We are talking paint job here, not life and death. So who are we to judge that one should go ahead despite what is involved
(A dishonest lawyer would say sure, we'll do it - after checking the credit score of the customer... - without mentioning what is involved in time, money and energy).
I'm with you with arbitration, though: less of a burden, less to lose so why not? No more guarantee of winning, though.
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Hey, didn't mean to upset you. Apologies if I was out of line. I didn't look closely at my paint either when I took delivery, so same thing could have happened to me. And believe me I am not sympathetic at all to corporations taking advantage of people. I'm disappointed Toyota is being so arrogant and unresponsive, especially since they went through all the unintended acceleration thing.
By all means, if you feel it is worth it, fight with all you got. I would be upset too. Still, its just a car. I personally don't deal well with fighting prolonged battles, but I'll do it if Ithink its worth it. That's something only you can decide.
I wouldn't want the car repainted because that's likely to cause more problems and WOULD affect resale. I ddon't think there is any way Toyota will trade you another car straight up at this point because of time and miles. It sounds like you don't like the corolla anyway, even aside from this issue, so even if they did would you be happy?
If you do end up continuing to pursue this, I would go to a car max aand get them to give you a detailed appraisal, which they will do for free. See if they note any paint defect and how much they deduct from the appraisal. That is good impartial evidence to take to arbitration. You need to demonstrate a tangible loss.
Didn't mean to take you to task, unfortunately today's world is buyer beware. I'm just not confident you have a strong case, having some legal background. I feel for you, I once bought a Subaru that burned oil badly right from day one, and fought a huge battle and wasn't completely satisfied with the outcome.
Only you can decide how much of your time, effort, and peace of mind this is worth to you. I don't think its fair to say you're a "quitter" if you decide this isn't one of the battles worth fighting. Its not worth being constantly unhappy and upset every time you see your car. Is there any way you could swing just trading it for a different model? Whatever you decide, best wishes to you.
By all means, if you feel it is worth it, fight with all you got. I would be upset too. Still, its just a car. I personally don't deal well with fighting prolonged battles, but I'll do it if Ithink its worth it. That's something only you can decide.
I wouldn't want the car repainted because that's likely to cause more problems and WOULD affect resale. I ddon't think there is any way Toyota will trade you another car straight up at this point because of time and miles. It sounds like you don't like the corolla anyway, even aside from this issue, so even if they did would you be happy?
If you do end up continuing to pursue this, I would go to a car max aand get them to give you a detailed appraisal, which they will do for free. See if they note any paint defect and how much they deduct from the appraisal. That is good impartial evidence to take to arbitration. You need to demonstrate a tangible loss.
Didn't mean to take you to task, unfortunately today's world is buyer beware. I'm just not confident you have a strong case, having some legal background. I feel for you, I once bought a Subaru that burned oil badly right from day one, and fought a huge battle and wasn't completely satisfied with the outcome.
Only you can decide how much of your time, effort, and peace of mind this is worth to you. I don't think its fair to say you're a "quitter" if you decide this isn't one of the battles worth fighting. Its not worth being constantly unhappy and upset every time you see your car. Is there any way you could swing just trading it for a different model? Whatever you decide, best wishes to you.
Scott,
Afraid I have to disagree with you. I don't see how anything was hidden, and likely the dealer doesn't see it as a defect. I agree, its a bad paint job but I've seen worse on new cars. I don't believe it has diminished value but an independent appraisal could answer that.
The buyer has been through enough. I know you're trying to encourage him but saying he is "quitting", "dying" and " laying down" is a little harsh to me. There have been times in my life i feel Igot taken advantage of. Sometimes I've fought,
other times not. There is nothing dishonorable about picking your battles, and deciding something just isn't worth your time and effort, based on your priorities and chances of success and size or award if you do win
Afraid I have to disagree with you. I don't see how anything was hidden, and likely the dealer doesn't see it as a defect. I agree, its a bad paint job but I've seen worse on new cars. I don't believe it has diminished value but an independent appraisal could answer that.
The buyer has been through enough. I know you're trying to encourage him but saying he is "quitting", "dying" and " laying down" is a little harsh to me. There have been times in my life i feel Igot taken advantage of. Sometimes I've fought,
other times not. There is nothing dishonorable about picking your battles, and deciding something just isn't worth your time and effort, based on your priorities and chances of success and size or award if you do win
I had the exact same opinion after trying it too. Reviewers rave about the 3 but seem to be confusing "stiff ride" with sporty, "noisy" with powerful, and "BMW type console button" with luxury car... Plus they test 30,000$ versions... Not to mention the Skyactive marketing hype to describe what is after all conventional engineering, albeit better done than before. So I was pleasantly surprise to find the Corolla LE Eco was a smooth comfy ride and more fuel efficient than 3 with a decent level of equipment (to me) for thousands less !
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